Some thought about the economic and moral crisis in America
The housing market is in a crisis, public education is a destroying our children, and we might be in for a recession. It's my belief that a major contributing factor to these problems and many more was the introduction of women in the workplace in the feminist movement. The increasing norm of duel incomes has driven housing prices through the roof, almost to the point where if you only have one income, you can't hardly make it. We have a generation of children being raised by state funded education after school programs and daycare employees. I know what many of you may be thinking, "Uh hey Ry, isn't your wife going to be a lawyer? What are you going to do when you have kids?" And honestly, I have no idea what we are going to do when we have kids. Thats a really tough question. It didn't used to be such a tough question. God called my wife to pursue her law degree, no doubt about it. She will be used mightily by God because of it.
It's just our reality as a society. You are at a disadvantage if you only have one income and I think that's sad. It is what it is and I don't really see that changing any time in the near future so we as Christians who want to raise up the next generation as pure, strong leaders we find ourselves in a bit of a conundrum.
I posted a video exerpt of The Quiet Man starring John Wayne and Maureen O'Hara. Ah those were the good ol' days. Enjoy :)
P.S. My wife has distanced herself from any association with my blog. A shrewd political move if you ask me. You read this entry at your own risk. Remember Jesus was the Rock of offense
posted by ryandofelmier at
3:48 PM
39 Comments:
Dude, could not agree with you more. I'm the single income with wife and kids, I tell you the truth, you can do it if you want to, if you don't want your kids being raised by some leftwing socialists at a state funded daycare. It's simple, we have to be less materialistic, why do we care so much about what we wear,why do we need to spend so much on a car, why do we need big houses with big mortgages we can't afford. The love of money and keepin up with the jones' has got us to this point. Our good friends on capitol hill don't help us out either, they just keep printing out more money to bail out unresponsible people, driving the value of the dollar down causing prices on everything to go up, gas, food, houses etc. It's not so much the value of your house going up in your equity it's the value of the dollar falling. Now the tools on the hill want to buy foreclosed homes and empty houses. What good is it to buy empty houses? I tell you the truth buy gold invest in tangebles turn your dollars into euros be smart with your money and you'll survive.
by the way have you seen obamas pastor speak?
Scary!
dogski out
Kelli,
Sorry your comment got deleted. I made a few grammatical changes and it deleted the whole thing. You should write it again, you had some interesting points
All I can say is AMEN! I have the fortunate situation of having a wife who will be working when we have kids but her work environment is at grandmas house where our child will grow up everyday with his or her grandma, aunt, cousin and most importantly HIS mother. But Ryan you do realize that you have just killed any chance of running for a public office. The left wing media would filet you. You would get my vote though and I would like to formally extend an olive branch to you to be my vice presidential candidate for the christianolism party.
Hi, Ryan... this is Alison... Need I say more? ;) Hahahahaha....
Hi Ry,
I thought deleting my comment was just your nice way of saying, quit commenting on my blog :)
My last comment was basically agreeing with your view's on women in the workplace. We have more problems with kids these days then we have ever had in history. More kids are in special programs and on medication and being "diagnosed" with ADD, ADHD, and all sorts of other behavorial problems that ever. Girls are getting pregnant at early ages, all kids are more sexually active then in any generation back. You cant tell me that the math doesnt add up. Mom's are shirking their responsibilities as mothers to be "relevant" to society and have a "real job". Kids dont have their mothers at home when they get home from school to talk with them and love on them and ask how their day was. When it gets down to it husbands and kids get 2nd best from most working mothers. Im not saying all women but seriously...when I get home at the end of a long working day the last thing I want to do is make dinner, clean house, take care of kids etc. There is no such thing as a woman who can do it all. Somehow the world has convinced women that being a mom is insignificant and you have to have a career to be fulfilled. I read a study recently where they took all the responsibilities of a house wife and put it into a dollar amount and if you paid stay at home mom for what she does day in and day out she would be worth around $120k annually.
The fact that Proverbs has a whole chapter designated to the vaule of a wife and mother should speak to us what we do at home is more valuable that anything we could do in the workplace. Its sad because I honestly hear more mocking of the Proverbs 31 woman then women trying to be like her.
I absolutely agree with Jay, we would rather keep up with the Jones'; money and things are more important than our families. I also agree with Kyle, if a wife has a job that she can work into family life, I think that is awesome.
Kids need to be with their mothers. And when things get too hard and it either comes to kids or work, you need to chose your family.
My Dad is a Pastor and my Mom was a stay at home mom. The word Pastor should tell you how much money he made. Did we have the best and the newest...not even close. But we were really happy, we had plently to eat and a roof over our head. To this day I am so thankful that my Mom valued us kids enough to stay home with us. My sister's husband is a youth pastor and she stays home with her kids. Honestly, they barely make it month to month but they are happy.
I RESPECT people who choose to have less so their wives can stay home with the kids. I respect Jay and Michelle, and Kyle and Chelsie.
It talks a lot in the Bible that when people put money above people, you will have a society that fails. And I think that is Ryans point, we have a society that is failing. If you took women out of the workplace and put them in the home like God intended, you would see so many wrongs right themselves.
Im not saying women cant work, just dont have kids and do the world a favor. If you want a career, have a career. If you want a family, have a family. Amen :)
Good topic Ry. You are giving us all a lot of food for thought. I would vote for you if you ran for publc office :)
Oh, another point I wanted to make. I feel like I have a specific calling that God gave me but I also know that it will come after I have raised my kids. So I dont think women dont have callings, we have just forgotten what our first calling is. :)
I agree with everything Kelli said. Your kids are little for just a few years and it goes so fast. And those years are very important. I cannot imagine going to work and taking care of everything at home. I love being at home taking care of my husband, children and home. I truly believe that it is my calling. Im not saying that I wont ever go to work while my kids are in school but I will definitely be home when they get home. And I love that that there are situations where other family members are involved. I get so annoyed when women will ask what I do and I tell them that I am a stay at home mom and they kind of brush me off. But I will tell you that when I talk to husbands with wives that work full time and they have children they will tell me that that is the most important job and you can tell that they wished their wives stayed home. Its the woment who feel that they dont have a purpose if they stay home. Its very sad. Children are the greatest gift and I think that you should do all you can to take care of those gifts. Sure it gets tough sometimes financially but we are never starving, we have a roof over our heads and we are warm. I agree that if you dont worry about what others have you can make it work.
The feelings of inadequacy which rocked women in the 50s and 60s and drove them to greater involvement in the workforce as a way of proving their equality never would have happened, however, if men had viewed them honestly as capable intellectual equals. In super-material America, the only way to prove your worth is with your pay-check, so naturally if women want to prove that they are as capable and valuable as men, the way to do so is with a career. It's unfortunate that the kids are the ones who have to suffer for this because the whole latch-key kid phenomenon is horrible and functional families are becoming few and far between. The real change needs to occur, though, in everyone's minds, not just the women's. Roles may be different, but the value of the sexes is equal and so the assumption shouldn't just be that women are to be at the sink or the stove because they can't do anything else, rather the ability to make that important choice of caring for a family if you have one should be left to the women, not leftover for them.
Ok, Good comments people. Here's a question for you for you future or present stay-at-home mom's(or Dad's, ya know, whatever). If you did want to pursue a career once your kids are "raised" at what point do you feel that your kids are "raised" enough to go back to work? Is it after they leace the home? Is it once they are all off to school? I mean once your kinds are at pre-school, what will you do all day?
I really need to spell check before I post a comment
As a future stay at home Dad, I will go back to work as soon as Allison finds a suitable husband to take care of her as good as I do.. I am thinking she will be 30ish, and I will be 60.. and then I want to be a lawyer w/ the ACLU
I may get a part time job after both kids are in elementary school but they arent in preschool or even kindergarten for a full day. And after that it sure would be nice to be able to clean the house without little ones at your feet all the time messing up what you just cleaned. Plus there are always opportunities to help out at the school. But Darren made a good point, who knows what is going to happen with the economy and I may have to go to work alot sooner. I dont see any reason why you shouldnt help out a little bit financially after the kids are in school but I also know that I want to be home when the kids get home and I want to be as involved as I can in their education.
Wow Ryan! I never knew you were so opinionated....II like it! You make some great points!
Your blog is one of my favorites to check in on, you & your guy commentors (sp?) crack me up....very entertaining. Amelia does good too :)
Hope you & Erin are doing well!
Tammie
Ryan!! I love it!!! What great, incredible words of wisdom. Let us always line up our lives with the Word of God, nothing else will stand, nothing. We can always say that God has called us to this and to that, but the Word of God is our rock in this world of shifting sinking sand. I pray that all women who call themselves christians would line up their lives with Titus 2. My opinion on homeschooling is as strong (and might I add...offensive):-) as yours is with this blogpost... And I say the same thing... Jesus is my rock of offense!!! Bless you buddy!!
Wasn't the Proverbs 31 woman a business woman? "She goes out to inspect a field and buys it; with her earnings she plants a vineyard." "She makes belted linen garments and sashes to sell to the merchants." I think it's totally possible to be a business woman and a great mom too. Sure it may take hard work and some creativity, but it's definitley possible.
Good point Alison
Personlly, I dont think men were created to stay home with kids. God did not give them a nurturing nature. They want to be provider's, they want to protect their family.
Im not saying there are not special circumstances where the wife needs to work and the husband stay home, but in general, I think that is not the case.
When I read Proverbs 31 I see mostly a woman who is concernd about her household, what they are wearing, eating, are they warm, how are they sleeping. Its her full time job to make sure that her family is taken care of.
I believe that the reason we have such an obesity problem in the US is because women arent in the home, preparing good healthy meals for their family. They are too busy with their careers to have time to make a proper home.
I think that part of being a stay at home wife and mother, you have the responsibility of make every dollar that your husband brings home stretch as far as it can go. Being frugal with shopping, meal preparing, etc. That is a job in and of itself. That is a good business woman.
I honestly dont see the point of having kids if at 2 months, a year, 3 years, you ship them off to daycare or a friends house or even your parents house while you go to work for 8 hours a day. Kids need their Moms. Grandma might be almost as good, but its not good enough.
Seriously, Kids arent a pawn in this game of life. If they are important enough to have, they are important enough to sacrifice for.
10 A wife of noble character who can find?
She is worth far more than rubies.
11 Her husband has full confidence in her
and lacks nothing of value.
12 She brings him good, not harm,
all the days of her life.
13 She selects wool and flax
and works with eager hands.
14 She is like the merchant ships,
bringing her food from afar.
15 She gets up while it is still dark;
she provides food for her family
and portions for her servant girls.
16 She considers a field and buys it;
out of her earnings she plants a vineyard.
17 She sets about her work vigorously;
her arms are strong for her tasks.
18 She sees that her trading is profitable,
and her lamp does not go out at night.
19 In her hand she holds the distaff
and grasps the spindle with her fingers.
20 She opens her arms to the poor
and extends her hands to the needy.
21 When it snows, she has no fear for her household;
for all of them are clothed in scarlet.
22 She makes coverings for her bed;
she is clothed in fine linen and purple.
23 Her husband is respected at the city gate,
where he takes his seat among the elders of the land.
24 She makes linen garments and sells them,
and supplies the merchants with sashes.
25 She is clothed with strength and dignity;
she can laugh at the days to come.
26 She speaks with wisdom,
and faithful instruction is on her tongue.
27 She watches over the affairs of her household
and does not eat the bread of idleness.
28 Her children arise and call her blessed;
her husband also, and he praises her:
29 "Many women do noble things,
but you surpass them all."
30 Charm is deceptive, and beauty is fleeting;
but a woman who fears the LORD is to be praised.
31 Give her the reward she has earned,
and let her works bring her praise at the city gate.
Absolutely, the Proverbs 31 woman cares about her household and looks after it. No doubt about it, but she is also a business woman at the same time. No doubt about that either.
This little debate comes at an interesting time. Over the past two weeks this issue keeps coming up at unexpected places in my life (hmmm...maybe You are trying to tell me something Lord??) At a recent women's meeting that I went to (by the way, this is Erin, not Ryan, hahahha) the speaker was discussing the proverbs 31 woman. Ryan and I have been talking about what we believe is God's plan for us, when it comes to having children over the past 6 months or so, and what our plan will be after law school. I truly believe that the Lord called me to be an attorney to fulfil the purposes of his heart. I know that there are specific places of influence that he is asking me to play a role in. As a result, I have been feeling an internal conflict. I have asked God, Lord if you want me to be a mother that is able to stay home when we have children, why have You asked me to do what I am doing by training to be an attorney. I know that the Lord is going to allow me, and desires me to do both. Ryan and I are not sure yet what this means, but I have no doubt that He will show us when the time is right.
The speaker discussing the proverbs 31 woman made an important point, and this is what I want to add to this little debate. In Bible times, the home was the center of society. Everything was done in the home. People met together and sought God (think about Pentacost), and they shared meals, and business took place out of the home. I don't think that the Proverbs 31 woman drove downtown to sell her sashes. I think most of what she did took place in her home. I truly desire my home to be the center as well. A center for my family, friends, and others to come and be blessed, and find the presence of God. When we have children, I want to be primarily in our home, but I don't think that this completely rules out doing anything outside of the home.
I suppose this means that we are just going to have to take it as it comes. I feel like all this will become more clear when we actually have a baby in our arms.
Words of wisdom Kelli!! I love it you guys, I only check this blog once in awhile, but it is cracking me up!
Erin, you know I admire you and ground you are plowing!! I mean who else understands more than me (prelaw...ahhh to go to law school) You have a blessed heart to understand where God is taking you and your willingness to lay it all down for God is why He is giving you every good thing! Bless you girl! Hey, I have been running with Brook a few times lately, I love that girl!
Ladies, you've missed the whole point of the proverbs 31 women. You see in the hebrew text, she considers a field and buys it, the word considers means works and the word buys it means for free. obviously this women is a poor black (like Jesus) slave in a country ruled by rich white people!The white man has held her down too long and given her aids and weed to destroy her and now they refuse to give her welfare. Now she believes in hope and for the first time in her life she is proud of her country.
Power to the people
Thank you, Reverend Jay Wright! I now see all things clearly. :)
I like your previous comment too about the proverbs 31 woman and creativity Alie! Certainly is important living where we live! I teach dance at THS from 5:30-7am well before my household arises so I don't miss out on being with them, but I still earn a little extra for our fam...creativity and business could go a long way for a lot of moms/households out there. I am always willing to notarize a loan or whatever extra thing I can do.
This is a tough one.. When I made the decision to keep Amelia home to relax and watch soap operas and Oprah all day, I knew I wouldn't have as much money and would have to limit her allowance. But I knew I did not want some day care putting Allison and Adam in a dark room to watch Dora videos all day, that my friends is Amelia's job!
Seriously! Becky made a good point, alot of this (all) is men's fault.. The post above has an attitude of staying home with the kids is somehow a lesser calling.. I see by some of the posts that alot of women have bought into that.. I go to work everyday, so that Amelia can succeed at home.. When I die, all that will stay behind are my children. no big house, no clothes, no cars, no money.. Just my children.. If my children do not have Amelia's and my imprint, whos double portion will they have? Allison is right, it is possible to have a career and raise your children, as long as you have a great support group.. Grandparents, uncles, aunts, close friends that share your ideas about how kids should be raised.. You better make sure your support group will be willing to help out first.. My sister and I were talking about how great it will be when my mom can watch our kids so Amelia and my sister can work.. My mom pretty much shot that down and i can't blame her.. She is retiring, not starting a daycare! My sister decide to pay Amelia to watch her baby... Unfortunately her baby was too high maintenance and Amelia had to tell my sister she could't do it anymore.. She was devestated.. instead of making the decision to stay home a little longer she found a daycare that was highly recommended.. a few days later she came to pick her baby up early and he was laying on the back concrete patio, 50 degrees out w/ no coat on.. all that to say, have a child before you make your plans on who will raise them.. and please don't say you can have a career and raise a family at the same time, by saying that you are degrading the stay at home! Next time say it is possible to have a career and have others and you raise your children.. I guess you have to roll with the punches.. try a career, but if your family suffers, end it..
Well said Darren! Wise!
Well at the end of the day, I can't find anywhere in the bible where it says men can work for money and women can't so what we all have are opinions and personal convictions for our life. We can pick all kinds of scriptures to support our opinions but I hope all of our goal is to allow the word of God to form our convictions. It's easy to be idealistic for me and some others who don't have children yet but the reality of it is, you do what you gotta do for your families well-being. I think God asks different things of different families. If you feel like you are doing what the Lord has asked of you today than you are in the will og God. Anyways I hope everyone still likes each other
Ha! Of course we dont hate each other. Its just a friendly debate.
I absolutely agree with Ryan that every family has to decide for themselves what God is saying to them. I wont stand before God someday for anyone except myself and give an account for what I did with my life.
I think its always good that we challenge each other but that doesnt mean that if someone doesnt agree with me, I dont like them anymore :)
But, if this has caused divison, then you are in big trouble Ryan :) Just kidding!!!
Oh don't worry about me. I feel it is part of my calling in life to be the stick that stirs the pot. I love this stuff. I think debates like this either solidify what I believe or make me think again about stuff. All Good
Just for the record, I have absolutely no intention of dropping my kids off at daycare and allowing a stranger to raise them. I don't know if I communicated that or not, so thought I should make that statement. And I agree with Ryan. At this point, we do not have children. Right now, all I can do is speculate. When we do, I will absolutely 100% make the best decision for their lives and they will be my priority no matter what. If that means that I stay at home with them full time, then so be it and I will be thrilled and honored to do so. And I'm not sure if the comment about "degrading stay at home moms" was directed to me or someone else, but if it was, I did not in any way mean to degrade stay at home moms. I was raised by one and she is my hero. I think stay at home mom's are absolutely amazing and in no way "less than" a woman with a career. I hope that communicates my heart. I guess I just have a lot of thoughts on this whole subject. And what a subject it is! :)
Kids change everything! Ditto on the Bible part, the debate part, conviction part, and a big 10-4 on the no intention to degrade part.. Am I the only one that when I get a conviction about something attempts to convict others on the same thing? Or is that just a loud mouth, opinionated and occasionally sticks his foot in his mouth thing? For the record... I referred to my sister's child as "baby" in my last post only because I forgot his name! Its Jack! Does that make me a bad uncle? My guess is that this debate "that Ryan started" will end soon, only because I find that the word "Bible" and the phrase "my own convictions" is a bit of a debate killer.. Its been fun, nothing personal towards any of you.. Amelia and I are still trying to figure out how we can do both... Anything we come up with either takes away attention from the kids or from each other.. we are open to ideas! In fact I'll bet Amelia will watch any of your kids if they are absolutely silent and potty-trained!
The great thing is that we are all great well minded people that want the best for our families, I have no doubt that all of you will make the best decisions for your families and even that means alison makes steve get three jobs. We are so blessed to have such good friends that I know will look out for eachother, and let eachother move in if they have nowhere to live. (so who is going to house us?)
By the way, everyday obama opens his mouth the more I'm convinced he is the anti christ. check out his punished with a baby statement.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GbZJYWjkAPo
Uh...mert negative.
I got worms!
I think the great thing about this argument is that it shows that opinions are like butts, everyone has one and some of them stink. We need to remember that the old testament is about showing us principles to apply to our lives not exact examples of what we should do. If were about giving us exact things to do us guys would be waiting until we were 30 to circumcise ourselves with blunt objects in the wilderness. Everyones situation is different when it comes to how they raise there children and whether or not to work. Some people have to have both people to work to make ends meet and some people don't. As long as women apply the principles of proverbs 31, which I think can be done in the workplace or at home, their marriage and children will be strong. Thats my two cents.
Hi Ryan (and all),
I followed a link from Amelia's blog, and really enjoyed your conversation. Hope you don't mind if I drop a note in.
I think, getting back to your original post, Ryan, that you would be very interested in a film that was just released called Demographic Winter (the web site is demographicwinter.com). It very much applies to what you began to discuss, and although it was made largely by unbelievers, it comes to some startlingly moral (read: Christian) conclusions.
Just a thought.
:-)
Bless you guys,
Karen
Well gang it's amazing how some of you know that God has a plan for your lives, but not just yet is your answer to Him, Maybe later???? Although some of your excuses are good ones I can't remember one disciple that when Jesus asked them to follow they said to Him they had other things to do first. You get my drift??
You all make good points and there isn't anything wrong with a working wife. Times change so you might check out your house payment. How about Jesus' attitude that if you don't work you don't eat. Well gang I could say a lot but my dear little nephews and their wifes seem to forget that their Aunt Bonnie is probably the strongest Christian woman and wife they'll ever know. She has worked at a Christian Ministry for 40 years while raising three kids, who are turning out better every day. My how prayer works! Oh..so do daycares Your grandma worked all her life under great hardship, but her children came out pretty good at the end. It would seem to me, as the good Christian that you are you have an advantage called Jesus. My prayer is that you use Him to your fullest and listen to His spirit and not your own. You can do all things through Him, but think you are without Him.
Uncle Jim
Thanks Uncle Jim! Great to hear your perspective!
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